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Created on: 02 July, 2009 Members: 34335 | Community Link: http://e-teaching.wiziq.com
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WiZiQ misleading their audience

by Marcus
Posted on 01 July, 2011

I don't know how true this is with their courses, but classes by paying teachers show inaccurate student counts.  For example, right now the following class is open: http://www.wiziq.com/online-class/543347-ca-ipcc-and-final-income-tax

It shows 132 "attendees".  Not only is the number an inflated lie to the community members, but they are not attendees.  They are merely people who signed up.  Out of those 132, only 4 have attended so far.  It's possible some or all of those 4 entered and left the class already, or maybe they haven't even shown up. 

I had a conversation with Sid who informed me that they do not allow teachers to open classes without the 24 hour waiting restriction.  However, look at what they are doing now. Flat out lying about the numbers.

I was also told some information which I haven't seen posted on the site which also conflicts with not allowing teachers to open public classes before the 24 hour limit. 

Part of the reason why you don't see me opening classes is that I don't always know my schedule, so I don't like to open until 3-5 hours before I want to teach. 

DEAR WIZIQ (and community),

Does it really matter?  Would it be better for me to become a paying member, make it look like 132 are coming to my class when in fact only 1 or 2 are?

How is this any different than me opening a class now at this very second and getting true numbers.  People would join my class because they have some interest, not because they might join at some later date (and not show up as evidenced by the drop from 132 to 4)

You don't get more "leads" because more people sign up.  You get more "leads" WiZiQ because you are a teacher available to teach.  Technology is not that far behind that you can't set up real-time text environments for people to meet without having to wait 24 hours.

Think about it. Imagine your public classroom open and 3 students walk in.  You teach them and 1 or 2 of them are seriously interested in continuing studying with you.  You could then schedule regular class times with them.  This is a lot better than scheduling dead time in the future, losing  more than 96% of the potential students.

Yes, out of 132, this paying member has lost the advantage of selling their class to 128 students.  Those 128 students haven't shown up.  Oh yes, they signed up.  They might see the recording (in theory), but there is no one to one interaction.

Is the virtual classroom a one to one interactive medium?  It's going against the grain to create a wonderful real-time teaching environment but then market yourselves by not actually making use of it.  You are just posting useless numbers.  No one is going to care if it means the classroom is closed to the student.

I hope for better days from WiZiQ.

by EFL Campus posted on 12 July, 2011
Marcus, I would support automatic scheduling (without vetting) for premium teachers if there is a system of accountability in place; so, if a teacher doesn't turn up, for example, there is a hefty fine. I think it is high time to change the teacher title to presenter title, anyway, but that is another story.
Alternatively, the right to schedule a public class without approval could come with a price tag,  even if it is only 1 cent per class.
by EFL Campus posted on 16 July, 2011
OK, guys, maybe you are right, and yes, students can vote with their legs, if not their money.

Ben, that is I suggested the most neutral term I could think of - presenter. It could possibly make the platform more attractive as a platform for webinars/commercial presentations etc, and open up new possibilities for WizIQ. On the other hand, we as teachers wouldn't suffer at all. I might just as well be wrong, though. :)

Peace, guys. Hope you are enjoying your weekend!
by EFL Campus posted on 17 July, 2011


Marcus, I was suggesting that all, me included, could switch to the presenter title instead.

by EFL Campus posted on 18 July, 2011
I have no idea why my suggestion was misconstrued as an attack on the teacher title or anyone's entitlement to don it , or as an invitation to form a clique, or whatever. I was being merely pragmatic, and "presenter" is just a term that is accepted and standard for the other big names out there (Adobe Connect, BB/Elluminate etc). Here the roles of the host (the person who manages the technical side of running a classroom) and the presenter (the person who delivers a presentation, facilitates a discussion, teaches, lectures, runs a chat show etc) are rolled into one, and that constitutes a huge advantage.

I think the "teacher" tag here has become a bit too narrow for the wide variety of purposes this platform is being used for, that's all.

Then if you don't call yourself teacher and them students, what do you
call the "arena" where they come to visit if not a "virtual classroom"? 

Well, I have heard them being called "sweethearts" so... the possibilities are endless. :D
How about calling them "attendees"? Are all people who come to your class students?

P.S.
"On the other hand, we as teachers wouldn't suffer at all."
"all, me included, could switch to the presenter title."
I think we won't be better or worse teachers, should we switch to another title; basically, teacher/student is just the way WizIQ differentiates between the two types of users they have.
Presenter/host is most neutral and much more convenient - in my opinion.

by Benjamin Stewart posted on 16 July, 2011
I agree, let the students decide, and they will regardless as to how many registrants or attendees there are for a particular class - the proof is in the pudding.  We have to realize also that there is value in the recorded sessions as well, both for those who attended the live session as well as those who did not.  So as WizIQers add to their repertoire (i.e., WizIQ recordings, content, forum posts, etc.), they are building value as an educator.  Regarding getting more attendees (session participants), I have to say that I have a better chance in getting more participants in my sessions if I schedule them one-to-two weeks beforehand than if I schedule them one-to-two hours before the class is to begin.  But that's just me. 

I agree that the word teacher is not the best term we should be using, but since WizIQ goes out across the world, terms need to be used that have the most meaning to the greatest number of people.  For example, does it sound better to pay a teacher or pay a mentor, facilitator, coach, curator, etc.  I could be wrong, but I think most cultures feel more comfortable thinking in terms of paying a "teacher".  It's all about perception and has nothing to do really as to the actual role the person plays in helping others increase their knowledge, skills, and/or habits of mind. 


by Forrest Greenwood posted on 03 July, 2011
I have often wondered if a rolling (24/7 or almost) class might not be a good idea.  You get ten or so English teachers areound the world teaching for an hour or so each.  Everyone could be familiar with an on-going lesson plan, or just offer homework help?  I think you'd also get b-lingual people which might be a sell, too.
by Englishteacher Namrata Arora posted on 17 July, 2011

Marcus, I am very pleased to read your observations. What has been your experience at conducting Live Public Classes on wiziq? Attending someone's class is way different than preparing and holding your own class as a Presenter/ Teacher.
From my list of almost 343 Public Classes (the one to be scheduled at least 24 hours in advance), there were times when I felt the need to remove this "waiting" thing; especially when I knew my students were ready to attend a (paid) Public Class. Then, all I did was to quickly schedule a Private class and invite the potential attendees to the class.

So, as a teacher, I easily schedule a Private Paid class (where students stay for the entire class) at the instant request of a student.

If we extend the scope of my consideration to FREE classes, then, I fully agree with you. Once a Public Class shows on the platform, it's very difficult for the student to predict if s/he will really be able to attend the LIVE session next day!

by George Machlan posted on 19 August, 2011

If I understood correctly, WizIQ plans a trial of allowing immediate class offerings.  But who knows when they will run that test.

There is one big snag with the repeated class functionality... you cannot make them paid classes.

I think that WizIQ has some very definitive models for how they wish their teacher base to conduct business.  To have the most conducive set of tools/capabilities, you would be an institution (or small independant company).  You would offer a very set product (a course that can be sold).  And a rather narrow list of items (courses) that can be maximized for marketing.  Mind you this is just my observation.

 

by Sid posted on 05 July, 2011
The class in question happens to be a recurring class and has around 100 classes scheduled in this series.

The count of attendees which is shown on the class page is the number of attendees who have registered for or have attended at least one of the class in this series.

The actual attendee count in any of the past class is also shown on the same page:




The attendance report is generated for each class after it is over and if the teachers want to contact only the students who attended that class, they can do so. 

Regarding 24 hours time gap for scheduling public classes, I have already communicated this to Marcus and its all about keeping a tap on the quality of the public classes being held on WizIQ. We already have spammers spamming users with messages and sometimes posting comments on class pages. The last thing we require is having them schedule classes which are inappropriate and drive away serious learners and teachers from our platform.

Right now we have auto approval feature for public classes in place. What it does is that it allows the users who have this feature activated for them to schedule public classes without waiting for approval from WizIQ team (the 24 hours window still stands though).  

We are already working on removing this 24 hour window for scheduling public classes and by the end of this month we will be activating this feature for selected few WizIQ members. 

Just like auto approval feature for public classes, this feature will not be available for all users of WizIQ.

In case you have any unanswered questions, you can catch me on Skype.

by Marcus posted on 05 July, 2011
A) Attendees in the class (136)
B) "The actual attendee count"

Why does there need to be 2 numbers?  Why not just "actual attendee count"?  What do you call "A" above if not a complete lie to the community?

attendee: a person who attends a conference or other gathering
registree: a person who is registered

If you don't like "registree", you could use two part combinations like "members signed up" or "users enrolled".  All of these refer to people who may or may not actually attend.

"its all about keeping a tap on the quality of the public classes being held on WizIQ"

If you are worried about spammers, I suggested a solution to this.  Right now, you could still get spammers, spaced out 24 hours apart.  You don't really prevent spam by punishing good users and making them wait.  In fact, making people wait 24 hours gives spammers a guaranteed 24 hours because there is the auto approval "feature".  

My solution was for each teacher to register a type of class they teach.  For example, an English teacher would register "English".  They could name the class differently, but it would be categorized as just English.  They couldn't change it to science or math.  If they were qualified to teach science or math, then they would register those.  After registering and getting approval (not auto approval) from WiZiQ, then that teacher would be allowed to open a class in that category anytime without having to wait 24 hours.  

This makes more sense than relying on the current long list which shows irrelevant classes to potential students and preventing teachers from opening classes without the 24 hour restriction.
by Marcus posted on 16 July, 2011
"if a teacher doesn't turn up, for example, there is a hefty fine"

If a teacher schedules a class for the next hour, they are more likely to show up than a promise to show up back "here" in 24 hours or more.

In defense of not showing up in general, I would like to point out that many hard working doctors and lawyers work late and have their patients wait or postpone a court hearing.  I think we should stay out of punishing teachers.  Let the students decide.

If the students don't have a problem showing up for a good teacher, then we should ok it.  If they do, then they have every right to pick a different teacher.  I don't see why WiZiQ needs to take attendance for teachers or students.


by Marcus posted on 17 July, 2011
"What has been your experience at conducting Live Public Classes on wiziq?"

My experience tells me that people who want to join my classes can't because they have to wait 24 hours.  So, they sign up like making a website a favorite with browsers.  Maybe they will return later, maybe they won't.  With a website, you can always return later.  With a wiziq class, you can only return at a specific time.  I see this as a serious restriction.

Students don't return on the promise I will show up later.  I lose interest in preparing for a class that will only have numbers and not real attendees.  If I could open the class immediately, I would feel more inclined to have something prepared to go over. 

As stated before, I would like to open a class when I am not busy, take students who sign up as they sign up, and then leave and do my offline stuff.  I don't want to register a class with a promise to show up 24 hours later.  Same with the students.  I want to be available when I create the class.


"Attending someone's class is way different than preparing and holding your own class as a Presenter/ Teacher."

I think you read my comments out of context.  Someone stated, "Only two or three have shown up and stayed for the duration of the class."  I wanted to clarify that during a class people come and go in a class.  We don't need to be only a teacher or only a visitor to see this.  I was not claiming they are the same thing.


"Once a Public Class shows on the platform, it's very difficult for the student to predict if s/he will really be able to attend the LIVE session next day!"

Exactly.  I'll add a little more, and Sid can be more specific.  Wiziq doesn't want to schedule a lot of classes at the same time.  For us, that's good because if you teach English and I teach English, then we won't be competing for students.  You could have students at one time, and I could have the same students at another time.  

Wiziq could just create slots.  First come first served.  If you register a class and no one else has, then you get that slot.  If someone else already scheduled a class, or specifically a related class, then you would just schedule before or after.
by Marcus posted on 19 July, 2011
"Here the roles of the host (the person who manages the technical side of running a classroom) and the presenter (the person who delivers a presentation, facilitates a discussion, teaches, lectures, runs a chat show etc) are rolled into one, and that constitutes a huge advantage."

I'll keep it short and simple.  Your definitions are not my definitions.  They are perfectly fine, and I am not attacking your definitions because they are different than mine.


"Are all people who come to your class students?"

Why not?  The point isn't to convince the other one to use 1 label.  That's not what I am trying to do.  By promoting "student" I am not trying to take away from your labels.


"teacher/student is just the way WizIQ differentiates between the two types of users they have."

Exactly.


"Presenter/host is most neutral and much more convenient - in my opinion. "

I feel that implies a sense of "entertainment", which in itself is not bad, but not the mood of my classes.  It's more like a training session, I am more of a coach/trainer than a presenter and host.  In my mind, I see teacher being both presenter/host and coach/trainer.  It can be a circle though, you could have your labels, I could have mine.  You can edit your online name in the virtual classroom to be presenter, and I could do that with teacher.
by Marcus posted on 17 July, 2011
"On the other hand, we as teachers wouldn't suffer at all."
"all, me included, could switch to the presenter title."

Do you mean then that "we as presenters wouldn't suffer at all."?

I don't quite understand your message then.  If there really is an issue here, then I would suggest WiZiQ set it up so that we can make "nicknames" for the teacher/person who makes the virtual classroom.  You just put in the title you want to be called.  I am not personally keen on the "presenter" label since I want students to interact with me.  If I have something to present, I could make a file and put it online for access 24 hours/day. 

I have seen some use the word "coach" instead of teacher.  This is closer in sync to my style of teaching, but if you are more of a presenter than that would be better than coach or teacher.  After you decide on your label, what do you call the people coming to your virtual classroom?  Then if you don't call yourself teacher and them students, what do you call the "arena" where they come to visit if not a "virtual classroom"? 

Should we have "presenter", "patron", and "auditorium"?  Maybe we should just scrap all the labels and just use the screen name we choose in our profile settings.  WiZiQ color codes it anyway, so there isn't confusion whose room it is.
by Marcus posted on 17 July, 2011
"On the other hand, we as teachers wouldn't suffer at all."

That's a rather self-righteous view.  Are you sure you want to establish this label for your "kind"?  Let's all go back to the same rung on the ladder and accept the fact the way you teach may not be the way I teach.  It doesn't make you or me a better teacher.  Nor does it mean you have to create a "club" of teachers who will call each other "teacher" while others should call themselves "presenter" because they don't fit or belong to your club.

This reminds me of high school.  You had your jocks, geeks, preppies, all looking down on the other groups for being different.  I have not attended one class on WiZiQ where somebody couldn't learn something from somebody else.  


"With the few classes that I have conducted my highest number of registrants has been ten. Only two or three have shown up and stayed for the duration of the class."

Define "duration of the class".  I have sat in some of the best teachers' classes and they usually have people coming and going.  What we see in your experience so far is that you lost 80% of your audience because everyone (including you) had to wait.  I highly doubt anything was weeded out, meaning the 20% were not the good students and 80% the bad ones.  Perhaps, if when each student signed up they could enter, then you would see more than 20% enter your classroom.  I am not going to say 100% would enter, because they would be signing up at different times.  However, you could open the same class twice a day for example.  Then you could get some of the other 80% who signed up at a different time.  Having to wait 24 hours means there is only one opening, unless you plan 2 classes.  I don't see how this is any better, because if they sign up then you will think you have more students, but you just have the same problem twice.  You don't know who is coming actually.  Makes you commit to the computer more and you need to do other stuff.

I would like to open a class when I am not busy, take students who sign up as they sign up, and then leave and do my offline stuff.  Maybe I only get 5 people to sign up, but I would rather have 5 people sign up and enter my "store" when open than have 10 people sign up and only 2 return when the store is open.

by Marcus posted on 19 August, 2011
Lorna, welcome to wiziq.  Right now, teachers who have paid membership are allowed to create classes which repeat.  So, if you pay wiziq, you can register one class to meet every Monday at 7pm for example.  That includes you, you have premium membership.  I don't pay, so I can only schedule classes one by one.

When you say "paid or free class", I am assuming you mean a class where students pay to attend.  I would like to be able to open any type of class at a time that is available.  What I mean by available is that wiziq may not want to have too many classes open at the same time.  So, if a few teachers are teaching right now, maybe I can't open right now.  However, I would like to be able to open a class in the next hour or so when there is an available opening.

The more users in classrooms, the more it puts on the server, and I understand that.  However, when it's not too busy, I would like to be able to open a public class (free or paid doesn't matter).
by suraj ajabrao nikam posted on 01 July, 2011
ok i c

by Doc Watson Guitar posted on 16 July, 2011
 I can understand the policy on weeding out spammers. While I have only been a premium member of Wiz IQ for a couple of months, within the first couple of days of signing up I received a message from a con artist who apparently wanted to "date" me. I reported it, and their account was quickly removed. As far as waiting for approval of a public class, I can understand that position too. With the few classes that I have conducted my highest number of registrants has been ten. Only two or three have shown up and stayed for the duration of the class. All of my classes have been "free" so far. I have noticed by watching the upcoming class stream that not too many students are willing to pay for classes.  One thing I would like to see is better management relative to the subjects taught. Perhaps categorizing the subject matter and providing a thread and stream for each category would make things a bit more coherent. 
by Doc Watson Guitar posted on 17 July, 2011

I appreciate the points you offer, Marcus. I have conducted classes lasting 60 minutes, and 120 minutes. Either way, I have experienced the same results. Yes, people have come and gone in my classes too.

As far as being committed to the computer, I spend most of my day on the computer since I retired.

On one of the videos about using Wiz IQ, it is suggested that classes be scheduled a week in advance to allow time for marketing to take effect.

I am the new kid on the block, and will have to experiment a bit with the virtual classroom concept. I also have an organization account that I am using through my website. I want to do some independent marketing to generate interest in my guitar lessons. The bottom line for me is that students gain valuable information that will help them become better guitar players.

by Doc Watson Guitar posted on 18 July, 2011

 A presenter and a teacher are not the same thing from my view. I am a presenter on radio and television. I give the news of the day, no teaching or interaction involved with my audience.

I am an instructor, "teacher" of music, and wear a entirely different hat in this scenario. I avoid using the word "class" in my "sessions," on WizIQ. 

Creating slots on a first come first served basis would be fine with me. However, I must reiterate that I think WizIQ should be set up with departments, just like a university. Having separate departments would make things easier for those seeking instruction. Each department should have an independent stream of lessons available. 

by Lorna Minewiser posted on 19 August, 2011
Marcus- When you talk about being able to offer a class when you want and have time open- would that be a paid or free class?  I'm brand new to wiziq and have followed this discussion with interest. Thanks,
Lorna
by Vikk Simmons posted on 27 July, 2011
--deleted-- Sorry, after rereading everyone's comments another time I decided I didn't have anything to add and I can't find a delete button. Too new here. ;) 
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